Be Ye Holy as I AM Holy

A theology student and brother in law to my pastor wrote concerning tattoos...just thought I'd post this since these are the kind of theology and words that are getting out into the churches today...This topic is continued from the topic on tattoo http://voiceofeliyahu.blogspot.com/2012/12/response-to-warning-from-bible-to.html?showComment=1356885615962#c8619028069012263403

Tony Thomas · I appreciate your enthusiasm for God and the importance of living a Holy Christian life.
But just as you were trying to defend the point of the "cutting or rounding of hair" i would like to use the same points.
During those days they used to make tattoos or cut marks on their body for the dead, in remembrance of them. The verse goes like this: "Leviticus 19:28
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.

Here if you read carefully, there is a coma (,) after "..for the dead, nor..."
A coma here refers to the continuation of the topic in which law is based. i.e. "for the dead" . It says not to make tattoos for the dead. The law does not say that "Do not make tattoos"

And bro Sorin, Please, firstly when you engage in these ideological discussions do not bring it on your mind immediately that the person not on your side is not a "PROFESSING CHRISTIAN" Please be open for discussions. You keep your point. I'll keep mine. 

Charles a Roman Catholic with whom Tony is trying to explain holiness says - My only point is that Leviticus and Deuteronomy are Jewish laws not Gods laws.... The ten commandments are Gods laws, and "love thy neighbor and God" is Gods law.....

My response - Charles, first and foremost, you make a distinction/separation between the laws in Leviticus and Deuteronomy against the ten commandments as Jewish laws and God’ laws repectively. Secondly, you keep referring to the ten commandments as “love thy neighbor and God”. So one last time I will again quote the scriptures for you to let you know that it is not me who says it as it is but the Word of God.

Would you agree with me that both the laws in Leviticus and Deuteronomy and the ten commandments were both given by God, setting aside your notion that it was written for the Jews only.

Now again I quote the same thing I’ve written before, in Jesus words, “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” Jesus replied: “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

 
Here are the basic’s…Jesus makes a distinction between the two “God’s laws”. First of all Jesus said “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment.” Would you like to correct Jesus on which of the two laws mentioned in the quoted verses has prominence over the other or is it plain and simple to understand? Secondly, Jesus said “Love your neighbor as yourself” which is like unto it.” It is like unto the first but is not the same as the first and greatest commandment “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind”. All the Law and Prophets hand on these? Question to be asked is, who Jesus was talking to and what did this question have in relevance to them. Answer would be “it was a “law keeping Jew” who questioned Jesus.
 

What did the law mean to Israel? The law was what governed their behavior. It covered all aspects of life. There were directives for everything and sacrifices for all the ways you could break the law. The law was how you did Judaism. It is what kept them in relationship with the God of the covenant and it was what governed their relationships with one another.
 

What did the prophets represent to Israel? The prophets represented Israel’s spiritual relationship to God. The Old Testament prophets were the primary voice of God to Israel. They kept Israel moving in God’s direction. They corrected Israel when they strayed from the Lord’s path. They revealed to Israel what the will of God was in any and every circumstance.
The Law was the outward to Israel. The prophets were the inward. Between the two, Israel’s whole relationship to God was governed. Yet, with these words, Jesus changes the entire focus of their religious practice.
 

The discussion of the day for the Pharisees, who were focused on the law, was what commandment of the law was the greatest. Jesus answer tells them that the Law itself is not even the greatest or most important thing. The law hangs on something else. The prophets hang on something else.
Let me use a very simple illustration to show you what this means.
 

We all have closets. Some of us have closets that are very organized. There are people who have all their clothes in order. Shirts are hung in one place, pants in another and so on. Others have color coordinated closets. Then there are those of us who just hang whatever wherever. No matter what degree of organization you have, all closets have something in common. There is some way to hang the clothes in the closet. This usually consists of a bar upon which we hook hangers.
 

All of the clothing in the closet hangs on that bar. The clothes are important. Without the clothes, there is no point in the bar. The order may be important to us. The closet itself is important. However, the whole purpose of the closet and the whole order of the clothes hang on that bar. If the bar breaks, the clothes fall into a heap in the bottom of the closet.
 

Obviously, this illustration has its limits. However, I think you can understand the point. The Law is important. The prophets are important, but without the love of God, they all will fall in a jumbled mess on the ground. On the other hand, everything will be in order and in balance if it is hung on these two commandments.
 

There are many doctrinal disagreements in the body of Christ. Many things are very important in our Christian walk. However, all of these things must hang on the two commandments Jesus points out in these verses anything else will fall short of the glory of God.
Highlighted in red taken from http://wjkiefer.wordpress.com/2012/04/25/everything-hangs-on-these-two-commandments/) 

So are the laws Jewish in essence? Yes, but so is Christianity! The only difference with Christianity is that we don’t keep the civic and ceremonial laws of the Old Testament (we don’t have to keep to the works of the law because Jesus has fulfilled all the requirements of the law) and unlike Jews we believe the Messiah had already come, died, risen and sitting at the right hand of God now and will return again. My point throughout our entire conversation was to direct your thoughts towards holiness for God rather than the law itself. Yet you keep pointing to it as a law for Jews. My whole point is to say that those laws are given by God who is perfect and whatever proceeds from the mouth of God is perfect. As such the laws given in the Old Testament are perfect but we being in our imperfect state cannot fulfill the requirements that a perfect law requires of us which is why as per the law we are condemned…God makes that very clear in the Old Testament. But in the New Testament we see that Jesus is the Grace of God by which the law can no more condemn us. For the law requires that without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin but because Jesus fulfilled every requirement of the law and by believing in Him we cannot be condemned to death by law anymore unless we would prefer to trample on the blood of Jesus even after knowing the truth. 

 
“Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” But question is how do you love the Lord your God? Jesus answers this by saying, “If ye love me, keep my commandments” Now how do you know that you are keeping the commandment “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.”? It is made clear by God’s own words 1 Peter 1:16 – “for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.” Now it says, “for it is written” but where was it written in the Bible, “Be holy, because I am holy”. Please read, 

 
Lev. 11:44 – “I am the LORD your God; consecrate yourselves and be holy, because I am holy. Do not make yourselves unclean by any creature that moves along the ground. I am the LORD, who brought you up out of Egypt to be your God; therefore be holy, because I am holy.” 

 
Lev. 19:2 “Speak to the entire assembly of Israel and say to them: ‘Be holy because I, the LORD your God, am holy."

 
So the words quoted in 1 Peter was taken from the book of Leviticus which consists of Jewish Laws? So is this Jewish or “God’s Law” – Be ye Holy for I am Holy. And what does “Be ye Holy for I am Holy” have to do with making yourselves unclean by any creature that moves along the ground? Somehow when I keep using that phrase “God’s Law” it makes me shirk a bit in the sense that the Leviticus Laws were written by man for man whereas the Ten Commandments were written by God, this is what you are trying to say. I shirk at this because then you are saying Moses wrote those laws and God had nothing to do with it. Again I reinstate God’s Laws are perfect and Christ never destroyed them but fulfilled everything required of those laws for us. God’s Laws are holy and man in his fallen nature can never fulfill the holiness required of those laws which is why James 2:10 says, ”For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.” And which is why Jesus came, not to abolish the law but to fulfill it!

 
The laws of Leviticus and Deuteronomy still stand today but we are not obliged to carry them out in terms of law but only in terms of holiness recommended to us of God. You talked about incest being immoral…you can state that incest is immoral against God’s standard by quoting “: “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.” But how were you able to define that as immoral? Since you yourself claimed, “Obviously anything immoral is a sin, but the question is "what is immoral?” Does the New Testament define that incest is immoral or does the Book of Leviticus or the Old Testament? So to state that Old Testament Laws were only for Jews is false and clearly you are deceiving yourself if you want to state it as otherwise. We know the failures of Israel before a Holy God and His Holy Laws in the Old Testament.

 
Again for the sake of argument I hope you have read this verse, Matthew 5:27-28 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery. But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” Charles, read these verses over and over again. Christ just made the commandment “You shall not commit adultery” into a much more severe one “who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart”…you step from the Old Testament into the New Testament the degree of Holiness expected of Christians is much more demanding than the Old Testament. Maybe you would want to correct Christ’s definition of adultery. That’s the degree of holiness expected of us. The Old Testament draws the line in terms of holiness and the New Testament just jumps it a few yards further to even much more holiness expected of us…so stop deceiving yourself!

 
Everyone can have their own perception about what’s immoral or unholy but that’s man’s standards and not Gods standards. Now that’s reality!

 
And as far as condemning is concerned…now I understand why you stress on “love you neighbor as yourself” and placing that above “loving God” because then it leaves you with the argument that I am condemning you or anyone taking a tattoo or doing anything unholy that is not acceptable of God. It also allows you to say to others “do whatever pleases you” because I love you as a neighbor. I am only convicting you out of love as a brother in Christ. I am not condemning you but convicting you and other brothers in Christ of the wrongs being done. There is only one person who can condemn you and He is the one before whom even the heaven and earth flees from. You will stand before Him who will open the books and if your name is not found in them…My only words for you is to stand and persevere in the holiness God expects of you rather than an intellectual dogma that is not going to save you and is an excuse to commit sin. You may think that what I am saying is pushing people away from God. God doesn’t want people on his side who stands against His laws and commandments either…not my words…but His.

 
Omnipresence of God and worshiping religious art is another issue…but unless you are right with the above…I don’t think I would even want to enter that.

 
Charles I have provided you Biblical references to prove my point but you haven’t done any…in fact all you did was try to intellectualize it your own way…sorry the Word of God doesn’t work that way. But again it’s your choice…just know that God also has His choice as well! And this is what I have to say to all those who profess to be Christians but distort the Word of God, be it a Pentecost, Roman Catholic, Baptist, Brethern etc.

Response to "Warning from the Bible to Christians who think its okay to tatoo your body"

The day before I posted on the subject "Warning from the Bible to Christianswho think its okay to tatoo your body" on both this blog and my facebook and I received wonderful response for it and so I thought I would add a little bit to it. Below are the quotes and responses I have received and my comment concerning them.

Tony Thomas 27 “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard. So, Christians shouldn't cut hair or beard eh??

 

Sorin Dorneanu Leviticus 19:27 You shall not round off the hair on your temples or mar the edges of your beard.

Tony, I do not know if you believe in God or if you profess to be a Christian. But God, in His supreme Wisdom, does not give a command in vain. All His instructions involve Holiness, which means that Christians are not to live as the unbelieving world, in the likeness of their pagan ways.

Leviticus 20:23 "You must not live according to the customs of the nations..."

To any man that at first approaches God's Word, it seems ludicrous and puzzling. But God says that the fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge and wisdom. When a man earnestly and wholeheartedly begins to seek God, it is ONLY then that he shall understand God's ways.

Lev. 19:27 is in reference to the customs of the Egyptians, Arabs, and other foreign nations living during the time. They used to show honor to their gods, their deity, by cutting the hair away from the temples in a circular form, so as to leave a tuft on the top of the head. This is done when anyone makes his temples, behind his ears, and his forehead alike, so that the circumference of his head is found to be round all about, as if they had been cut with a bowl. In this manner the Chinese, Turks, and Hindus cut their hair to the present day.

Additionally, the hair was much used in divination among the ancients, and for purposes of religious superstition among the Greeks.

God is thus saying : Do not live like unbelievers because God will deal with you accordingly.

Charles Allison The only problem is Jesus himself didn't follow the laws of Leviticus and Deuteronomy. 

"I tell you in truth, there is only one commandment: love thy neighbor"

The laws of Leviticus and Deuteronomy were social governing laws of the Jews not commandments of God. They were provided for social context. Saying not following them is a sin is like saying "speeding on an empty road is a sin" It just doesn't make sense.

My response to the above

God has separated us for Himself and as such we are to lead a holy life just as He is holy not living according to the ways of this world but according to the ways of His Word for us. Colossians 2:8 says, "Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ."

I will begin with this verse - 2 Tim 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness. This would mean that from the start of the Bible in Genesis i.e. “In the beginning…” to Revelations last words “The grace of the Lord Jesus be with God’s people. Amen.” were all God breathed and are useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness. God’s words are perfect and so are His laws. In fact God is the embodiment of perfection that we in our fallen nature can never comprehend let alone become. It is an imperfect man that cannot fulfill the requirements of a perfect law that required the Grace of God to be revealed in His time so that the requirement of that perfect law may be fulfilled in us through Him. 

When God created man, He created him in His own image and likeness, why even the very breath of life in us was “God breathed”. If God wanted us to have tattoos or piercings on our body, every new born should be born with it, we don’t have to give God a helping hand with anything. Besides by doing that a Christian is blaspheming the very image and likeness of God. 1 Corinthians 3:16-17 says”Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.” This verse is an echo from the past when Solomon created the first temple of God Ref. 1 Kings 9:3-9 “But if you or your descendants turn away from me and do not observe the commands and decrees I have given you and go off to serve other gods and worship them, then I will cut off Israel from the land I have given them and will reject this temple I have consecrated for my Name. Israel will then become a byword and an object of ridicule among all peoples. This temple will become a heap of rubble. All who pass by will be appalled and will scoff and say, ‘Why has the Lord done such a thing to this land and to this temple?’ People will answer, ‘Because they have forsaken the Lord their God…” Stephen in his last words recounted the words of the prophet “Heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool. What kind of house will you build for me? says the Lord. Or where will my resting place be? Has not my hand made all these things?” Yet this the same God who does not desire and whom anything that we create can never hold, the same God desires and has chosen the very work of His hand “Adam” to be a temple of God. That is why the Bible says in 1 Corinthians 6:19-20 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's. Question would be, are you glorifying God by putting tattoos on your body? Or are you glorifying yourself and blaspheming God? Did man by falling from the glory of God, lose the tattoos and piercings that was originally on Adam which must have been on God as well since Adam was made in the image and likeness of God. And by carving images and piercings, man is trying to regain the nature he was in before he fell? If the answer is yes to the above, you must question which god you serve or if you serve any god at all!

But you can push that aside by quoting, "I tell you in truth, there is only one commandment: love thy neighbor" How do you know that you are loving your neighbor in the way God wants you to? You have conveniently chosen a verse to suit your needA young man once asked which is the greatest commandment of all. “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. ³⁹ And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” My question then is, stating that there is only one commandment i.e. by loving your neighbor as thyself would it mean that it is a greater commandment than loving your God? And by adhering to loving our neighbor can we leave out the commandment to love God? But if Jesus is right by stating “Love the Lord thy God with all your soul, all your heart and all your mind” then how can you know that you love your God or how can you show your love to God? Maybe Jesus words, “If you love me you will keep my commandments” is muddled by a lot of other things that our ears are itching to hear. But what are your commandments my Lord, we may ask. For this we might need to refer to “All the Law and the Prophets” at least in the sense of holiness to God rather than pushing it aside as civic or ceremonial laws pertaining to a nation some 4000 years back.

I quote, “Saying not following them is a sin is like saying "speeding on an empty road is a sin"” True, speeding on an empty road is not a sin in the worldly sense. I say worldly sense because there are laws of the land and God has asked every Christian to even obey those laws. He has also mentioned in the Bible the only time that the law of the land was not adhered to was when it was against the commandments of God concerning the holiness of His children. Speeding on an empty road is not a sin in the worldly sense, but even from the worldly standpoint it can also land you six feet under. In the part of the world where I am right now people have died, speeding on an empty road! May not be sin by worldly standards but sure is definitely a gamble with your life. Do you want to take a gamble on your spiritual life or just follow the Word when it says “Be ye Holy as I am Holy”?

Israel - The Clock of Biblical Prophecy - Curtain Raiser

Once while studying "Revelation & Daniel", a student in our Bible study class asked the mentor to explain the "elect" mentioned in Matthew 24. Our professor faltered a bit before responding to that question as "ethnic Israel" being mentioned there since the rapture has already taken place and that part of Matthew 24 was speaking about the tribulation and the events to unfold. Another supported our professor by saying that, "These "elect" are the people who become believers during the Great Tribulation of three and one-half years". The rapture has already taken place some time before the Antichrist sets himself up as "God" in the Temple as mentioned in Matthew 24:15 - “So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation, spoken of through the prophet Daniel - let the reader understand." The professor was also quick to mention Revelation 3:1&2 - "After this I looked, and there before me was a door standing open in heaven. And the voice I had first heard speaking to me like a trumpet said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after this.” At once I was in the Spirit, and there before me was a throne in heaven with someone sitting on it." This verse he said was where the rapture of the church is taking place, since no where after this do we see the church being mentioned until of course towards the latter part of Revelation. So rapture of the church must take place before the tribulation and the elect mentioned by Jesus are those who believe in Jesus after the church has been taken up. So I am going to outline a few of the materials that I was taught in my church since I was born again and baptized.

1. The church will be raptured before the tribulation
2. The Holy Spirit will cease to function as He did from the day of Pentecost i.e. He will revert back to how he worked during the Old Testament times.
3. The resurrection of saints at the coming of Christ i.e. at the rapture before the tribulation...so are there two resurrections and two rapture?
4. Replacement & seperation of church in the covenantal relationship between God & Israel. 
5. Christ's return is as a thief...but to whom and why?
6. The secret return of Christ was taught by the apostles, early church fathers and literature...is that really the truth?
7. Is it of any use to know whether the rapture takes place before or at the end of tribulation?

How many can back this up with scripture, I mean in a definite wording within the Scripture and not vague explanations by reading into the text? I am going to post a series on this subject since we are at the end of age and the above mentioned issues do not just affect Israel as a whole but also shows the weak state that the church is in. I am not going to try to win you to a view on rapture but to try to make you question what you've been taught and follow in the light of scriptures, just I have and just as I continue to do so.

Warning from the Bible to Christians who think its okay to tatoo your body.

 

When the world was celebrating Christmas yesterday, we celebrated another blessed year added to my mom's life. But even more special was the fact that we as siblings got together in one place after so long that I can't even remember when the last time was when we had such a reunion. But something that really affected me then was the fact that my brother who grew up in a Christian family, learning Sunday School from a strict Pentecostal teaching soon fell into a relationship with a woman who turned him and continues to turn him away from God and His Word for him. I was upset that my brother got another tatoo on his hand even though I warned him that he is going against the Word of God in doing so. So this morning I got to quote the scriptures to my brother, that I so long failed to quote to him a long time back. Hope it touches him. I am quoting the below from the article http://www.biblebelievers.com/watkins_tattoos/bible.htm

Hope you share this with your loved ones and friends who think it's okay to tattoo.

Leviticus 19:28
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.

The bible makes it clear that your body is the temple of God. 1 Corinthians 6:19-20 makes this very clear.

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

The Lord warns several times of the seriousness of defiling the temple of God – your body! In 1 Corinthians 3, the Lord clearly and sternly warns against defiling your body – the temple of God. If any man defiles the temple of God – HIM SHALL GOD DESTROY!

1 Corinthians 3:16-17
16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

CHRISTIANS YOU ARE WITHOUT EXCUSE THAT YOU NEVER KNEW THIS THING WHEN YOU WILL SOON STAND BEFORE YOUR CREATOR AND WHEN HE QUESTIONS YOU...WHY?